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evildrummerhb
Bad lesson

GK Event: Played in a GK Event

Member Since:
    June 5, 2009


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Tuesday December 6, 2016 11:06 AM
A few weeks ago I decided to take a tune-up lesson, as my game has been kind of wobbly as of late. I won't mention who it was with, as I'm sure he has helped many a golfer, but for me it was a total waste.

I started by hitting several irons on a launch monitor, and all shots were very consistent. I was told I have a really nice swing for someone that didn't pick up the game as a youth, and the instructor was surprised that I don't break 80 on a regular basis with my swing.

Then, the bad part. No suggestions were made about fixing this or that about my swing; he proceeded to force me into preconceived positions to match "their" definition of a perfect swing. This included changing my grip from overlap to interlock, my posture to a way more extreme hip bend, etc. because "that's how we do it".

Sorry, not for me. I've been digging craters behind the ball ever since. Just got everything back to almost normal yesterday. I have no problem with the instructor, he was very nice and personable, but I'd rather go to someone that makes tweaks to the base I've built over the years instead of forcing me into a completely new pattern.

Anyone else experience this? I'm thinking of ponying up the cash to go see Monte Scheinblum at Oak Creek, I hear he is one of the best at taking what a golfer has and making it better.
REPLY
 Message #81629
criley_4way
RE: Bad lesson
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    June 12, 2010


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Tuesday December 6, 2016 11:15 AM
That sounds awful. A lesson should consider you, what you want and the time you have. I dislike the one size fits all model.
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 Message #81630 - This was a reply to message #81629
sngernz
RE: Bad lesson

GK Event: Played in a GK Event

Member Since:
    January 24, 2005


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    Bubba!
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Tuesday December 6, 2016 11:38 AM
QUOTED  A lesson should consider you, what you want and the time you have. I dislike the one size fits all model.

Completely agree with c.riley. That should be the first question by any instructor, something like 'what do want to get out of this lesson?'

Same happened to me years ago ... I learned very quickly that I'd never even come close to producing a 'perfect' swing, so I found a guy (Dave Hobby) who worked with what I had and to try to improve it to a point where I could develop something consistent. Works for me.
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 Message #81632 - This was a reply to message #81630
Itslikeimsayin
RE: Bad lesson
GK Event: Played in a GK Event

Member Since:
    July 21, 2003


Favorite Golfer:
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    DragonRidge CC


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Tuesday December 6, 2016 11:40 AM
This is the exact reason I've only taken one lesson my whole life. Same thing happened to me and it messed up my swing for a long time.
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 Message #81633 - This was a reply to message #81629
evildrummerhb
RE: Bad lesson

GK Event: Played in a GK Event

Member Since:
    June 5, 2009


Favorite Golfer:
    Hunter, Phil, Freddie C.
Favorite Golf Course:
    Emerald Canyon


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Tuesday December 6, 2016 12:57 PM
Thanks for the replies, glad I'm not the only one out there. I had a golf mentor, if you will, who taught me everything I know now. But he passed away five years ago, and since then I've lost a lot of distance and accuracy. I know why; I've developed a bit of a flippy release. I just don't know what I need to fix, I know it's a product of something I'm doing earlier in the swing. I made a pretty heavy lifestyle change a few months back and have rapidly lost about 25 lbs...I have around 25-30 lbs more to go before I'll be satisfied so I may wait until then to really dig into what's wrong.
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 Message #81634 - This was a reply to message #81633
criley_4way
RE: Bad lesson
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Tuesday December 6, 2016 1:29 PM
Given the HUGE change in your body (Congratulations) you shouldn't expect the swing to feel the same. Get some points of reference and make sure you are getting into good positions. With the new body things will feel different.

I've always like the 30%, 50% 75% swing speed with focus on contact and ball start/flight.
REPLY
 Message #81636 - This was a reply to message #81634
1PLUS1
RE: Bad lesson

GK Event: Played in a GK Event

Member Since:
    March 27, 2007


Favorite Golfer:
    Seve; Nick Faldo
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    Belgrade Lakes (Maine)


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Tuesday December 6, 2016 1:50 PM
Evil...

I think you did your golf swing, and psyche, a lot of good by abandoning that instructor, regardless of what his level of success with other students might be. This so-called "Method Approach" that has taken hold of the instructional side of golf may be responsible for most of the frustration that has ultimately led many golfers to forego trying to improve their swings, and in some cases, give up on the game completely.

What really caught my attention was the grip change; going from overlap to interlock is a drastic adjustment, one that might require hours of practice before moving on to another part of the swing. Add to that the increased hip tilt and it's no wonder you felt like you'd never swung a club in your life...and had the results to confirm that sensation. Multiple changes to the golf swing are best made in stages; in my view, making wholesale adjustments all at once is hardly going to instill any confidence in the student.

I believe a good instructor, whether he endorses a "Swing Model" or not, will first ask the student what their goals are and how much time they're willing to put into the process in order to implement and ingrain the corrective swing changes. In your case, it could be something relatively simple or, conversely, multi-faceted, but to try to squeeze a round peg into a square hole makes no sense to me. Your physical capabilities as well as level of talent with regards to how well you strike the ball must also be taken into account, which is why I do not subscribe to the "One Swing Fits All" philosophy.

Concerning Monte, he definitely has a following yet, like other instructors, a number of detractors as well. His videos are fairly straightforward and not cluttered with the "Zen-type" ramblings I've seen from others; whether he's the guy for you is anyone's guess. Like a bottle of wine, price paid doesn't always guarantee quality; there may be other less expensive options available that may be better for you, especially if a series of lessons are necessary to get your game in shape.

Wishing you good luck in your quest and continued success in your "makeover".

[[Edited by 1PLUS1 on Tuesday December 6, 2016 2:52 PM]]
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 Message #81637 - This was a reply to message #81634
evildrummerhb
RE: Bad lesson

GK Event: Played in a GK Event

Member Since:
    June 5, 2009


Favorite Golfer:
    Hunter, Phil, Freddie C.
Favorite Golf Course:
    Emerald Canyon


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Tuesday December 6, 2016 2:50 PM
Criley and 1PLUS1, thanks for the insight and great advice. I feel I can make a much more athletic move through the ball now, which may be part of the problem...more mobility means the opportunity for more moving parts.

1PLUS1, can you recommend any other non-method golf instructors in the Orange County/East LA County area? Like I said, I'll probably wait a few more months before really diving in, but it doesn't hurt to get the research done. I'm really looking forward to getting re-fit too; I have my eye on a Srixon combo set of irons that would be a sweet addition to my bag
REPLY
 Message #81638 - This was a reply to message #81637
1PLUS1
RE: Bad lesson

GK Event: Played in a GK Event

Member Since:
    March 27, 2007


Favorite Golfer:
    Seve; Nick Faldo
Favorite Golf Course:
    Belgrade Lakes (Maine)


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Tuesday December 6, 2016 3:19 PM
Evil...

I'll have to do some research but, off the top of my head, I'm not familiar with any instructors in your region. Since I'm in the San Diego area, I can only make a recommendation based on my experience. If you're up to taking a drive down this way in order to obtain an assessment of your swing, I'd be more than happy to throw out a couple of names.

I've worked with a few top-notch instructors over the years but find my current "coach" to be the least restrictive in terms of establishing a forced or set way to swing the club. Granted, there are certain principles that need to be adhered to but being able to disregard the "BS" perpetrated by so many high profile instructors has allowed me to free my mind of any preconceived notions about the golf swing. In other words, if I'm instructed to allow my left knee to kick in behind the ball on the backswing like Sam Snead...as opposed to keeping it stable and over the left foot like the "Modern Swing" tells you...then that's what I do. It all boils down to trust and faith in the instructor...and the proof has been in the results.

I appreciate the kind words and will get back to you if I have any additional information to offer. And Srixon makes a good product...I still have a set of I-506 irons in the garage...so it looks like you're headed on the right direction!
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 Message #81639 - This was a reply to message #81638
SCGolf
RE: Bad lesson

Member Since:
    April 29, 2005


Favorite Golfer:
    Angelo Erikson
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Monday December 19, 2016 4:45 PM
QUOTED I started by hitting several irons on a launch monitor, and all shots were very consistent. I was told I have a really nice swing for someone that didn't pick up the game as a youth, and the instructor was surprised that I don't break 80 on a regular basis with my swing.

Then, the bad part. No suggestions were made about fixing this or that about my swing; he proceeded to force me into preconceived positions to match "their" definition of a perfect swing. This included changing my grip from overlap to interlock, my posture to a way more extreme hip bend, etc. because "that's how we do it".


The way this is written, it sounds like you were bullied into something you were not looking for. ANYtime there is a fundamental change in a swing, there should be an explanation of how long the change should take to implement. If the 'advisor' doesn't know... well, he isn't very good at his craft.

QUOTED I made a pretty heavy lifestyle change a few months back and have rapidly lost about 25 lbs...I have around 25-30 lbs more to go before I'll be satisfied so I may wait until then to really dig into what's wrong.


First of all, congratulations and good luck with the rest of your weight loss. I bet your ankles, knees, hips and back are thanking you as well. Any time there's a shift in weight (gain or loss) there's a change in distance. E=mc2 Pretty simple. When kids are growing (we know this when our kids are abnormally hungry), they are growing. Muscles, bones and nerves grow at different rates. It's important to 'swing it' every couple of days. Same when there's a weight loss. Weight is shifting differently, and the swing is changing. It's an easier migration when you're moving with the process.

BTW, if your interested in changing your grip, get a couple paint mixing sticks from your local home improvement store. Tape 2 together and keep them around (especially in the car). Whenever you have a few seconds, pick up the stick... flat on the side and V-out the top line. In a couple weeks, it'll feel comfortable and you'll never be checking your grip.

FIGHT ON!!!!
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 Message #81773 - This was a reply to message #81634

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